scan disk isn't

[Shaytar]

Our puter is apparently having a problem. Scan disk will not finish running. It gets to about 34000 of 39000 clusters, and the whole puter seizes up. Nothing works, can't even cancel scan disk, just have to reboot.

Is this a serious problem? Do we need to take it for professional inspection?
Any suggestions of diagnostics we could run on it?

ah, the joys of cobbled together pc's....

Shay

[pqwabbit]

oh thats just freaky - which computer is this one? the old one or the new one - whats the specs etc? do ya get erros wihout a surface scan? crud that could be anything and I sure hope it aint nothihg wrong with the disk sounds more liek a software glitch - i hope sorry no difinitve answer here
anything else acting up?
man I tell ya you gota get nuts and bolts for this kinda stuff - sometihng lie that they have their own scandisk program so if it's a windows software glitch it wouldnt really matter it should work.
you can defrag adn stuff ok right? so lie the disk itself is probanbly ok I woiuld think.

Lea

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I can only please one person per day.
Today is not your day.
Tomorrow doesn't look good either.
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www.massey.i-p-d.com/index.shtml (http://www.massey.i-p-d.com/index.shtml)

[Bekariso]

Hey Lea

Thanks for answering. This is the old one, Pentium 75, 32 Ram, about 1.2 Gig HD (500+ MB free), bought used from a guy who kinda put it together himself. . . .

No, we haven't actually tried defrag on it yet. As for other stuff acting up, the reason we were trying to scan it anyway was because yesterday morning we had to try to boot it three times before it would finish loading.

I tried twice to download that trial of Nuts and Bolts you recommended, but couldn't get a complete download from it -- it kept timing out (and I was using "Internet Loafer" so the ISP wouldn't disconnect me). Time to try to get it again, I think.

Most of the programs seem to be working okay on it, I was able to zip and backup my most recent files yesterday once we got it to boot and load completely.

Thanks for the ideas. I'll try defrag and attempt to get Nuts and Bolts again. Any other trial downloads you recommend if I can't get it again?

Take care,

Bekariso

[meikel]

Hi,
I don't know which Scandisk you tried, but there are two of them (at least on Win95/98).

I suggest, you get your machine into DOS-Mode (that is an option instead of shut-down). Simply type "scandisk" at the command prompt and let it do its work.

Having a simple HDD problem under Windows is real pain, but under DOS, scandisk should handle it. But give it some time. If somethings *is* wrong, it might take a good deal of time to get over it.

Meikel

[Justin]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think DOS scandisk is the same as Windows scandisk - the Windows version is just a front end. Also, you can't defrag until a successful scandisk - defrag won't let you.

I do agree that it's best to do it in DOS anyway, though, because less stuff is running and certain things just act funny with Windows around - however, in DOS the disk caching is far slower, so a surface scan will take a while - that's what I recomend is a good old DOS surface scan, then a defrag.

One question: is that a Seagate drive? Also, did you convert to FAT32? Ok, that's 2, but there is a major conflict with Seagate's OnTrack Disk Manager when you run FAT32 in 98 or 95 OSR2. There's a readme file hidden somewhere on the 98 CD that explains this conflict. Basically, it will hang for a long time before booting, and although it will say it's FAT32, it really isn't.

This caused problems for me with a Seagate 1.2G and it took me uninstalling OnTrack and formatting it to FAT32 to fix it. Been running fine since.

If not, well, I just gave you a bunch of useless hot air then http://www.aota.net/ubb/smile.gif


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Justin Nelson, SFE Inc.
http://www.vdj.net

[Bekariso]

Thanks again for more input.

I ran defrag, and about half way through, it suddenly restarted itself (very weird), but it did finish, and didn't report any errors. However, I still couldn't scandisk afterward (from Win95) without it locking up so I had to reboot.

I will try it from DOS and report back tomorrow.

Still haven't been able to download Nuts and Bolts -- the McAfee server was too busy today to let me navigate their site (tsk, tsk).

I don't have FAT32, and I haven't heard of a Seagate drive, so I don't think I have one.

By the way, for anyone who's confused, Shaytar and I are housemates. They posted first cuz they were on their happy spiffy new computer while I was rebooting this one AGAIN yesterday.

Thanks for your help!

Bekariso


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Bekariso
susogi.net/Bekariso (http://susogi.net/Bekariso)
*** We prefer to remain anomalous ***

[meikel]

it suddenly restarted itself (very weird)

nothing to worry. That is very common. Some program (or windows itself) just wrote something to the harddisk. That causes defrag to restart immediately.

You can force this effect usually by launching some other program while doing a defrag.

Greetings from me
[nbsp][nbsp]Meikel Weber

[Terra]

I've got 2 cents to toss in on this...

If you are using Win98, and if you have like the floating 'toolbar' down in the taskbar... Windows defrag/scandisk will keep restarting and never finish (very frustrating)... Grab the 'toolbar' handle and pull it up to the desktop, it will then turn into a modul window, then close it... That will allow defrag to work properly... Same goes for scandisk as well...

--
Terra
--Win98 == 5 steps forward, then 10 steps backwards--
FutureQuest

[This message has been edited by ccTech (edited 02-14-99).]

[Jacob Stetser]

nothing to worry. That is very common. Some program (or windows itself) just wrote something to the harddisk. That causes defrag to restart immediately.
You can force this effect usually by launching some other program while doing a defrag.

The first time an OS reboots without telling me, I'm going to toss it out the window.

Freezing up is one thing. But I don't want it rebooting itself. That's for me to decide.

Jake
P.S. Why does the defragmenter ALLOW other programs to write to disk while doing its job? That's nuts!

If a defragmenter is doing a full defragmentation, it should maintain control of the computer, not allow other programs to to do things in the background.

--
some things are still sacred.

[This message has been edited by Jacob Stetser (edited 02-14-99).]

[Shaytar]

Terra, we're using Win95, not 98, just to clarify.
And this puter is soooo clunky!!!!
wish we could chuck it, but it has to survive until at least sept, so we need it booting up reliably!

I think this got asked indirectly before, but how would I reformat the harddrive? (would I want to? *shrug* -- need to do something to this darn thing if only to make ME feel better!) http://www.aota.net/ubb/smile.gif

[Justin]

I have to say, I've been using 98 since the day it was released, I defrag once a week (usually), and I've never had a problem with the indespensible toolbar. And when defrag restarts, you should notice that catches up to where it left off after only a few seconds, because it's still xx% defragged. It's not like it has to move everything all over again.

My only experience with Nuts and Bolts was when it caused a major crash on a laptop that was only a month old. It's been long since deleted and never reconsidered.

I believe defrag was what restarted, not Windows. I've never had Windows reboot without asking (or strongly recomending) first. And never during (or after) a defrag/scandisk.

Also, the defrag that comes with 98 is really good - it's actually made by Intel (at least it has Intel's name on it), not Microsoft, and it helps more frequently used apps start and run faster. I really do notice the difference.

To format, this means wiping everything out and starting from scratch. If you're prepared to reinstall Windows and have backed everything up, boot with your boot disk, and at the DOS prompt, type:

c:\>format c:
WARNING!! ALL DATA ON NON-REMOVABLE DISK DRICE C: WILL BE DESTROYED!!
ARE YOU SURE? Y

Then install Windows again.

I hate closing the toolbar, because the next time you throw it on, the shortcuts are in alphabetical order and I have to rearange them. Again, I've never had a problem, and I've never had to close it - just seems wierd, as I don't see why it would cause it to restart.

Oh, by the way, if you format, I would put either 98 or 95 OSR2 on there and format to FAT32, especially on a smaller drive. On my 1.2 it freed up about 300+ megs of space.

With FAT16, every file, shortcut, etc, takes up 32K, no matter how small the file. With FAT32, this is reduced to 4K. Now, the fat table itself grows a little, which you won't notice, but the space freed is immense. Even larger files take up space in increments of 32k with FAT16, so every file on your hard drive is wasting, on average, 16k of unusable space. With FAT32, it's reduced to 2k average wasted space.

Do a DIR *.* /s and see how many files are on your drive. Now multiply that by 14 (16k - 2k) and that's how many kilobytes you would free up with FAT32.

Well, that sure was a rant, huh? Well, just wanted to throw in a few of my opinions, which usually don't amount to much, but hey, there they are. Do with them what you will http://www.aota.net/ubb/smile.gif


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Justin Nelson, SFE Inc.
http://www.vdj.net

[Shaytar]

Hey Justin

Can't afford to buy a copy of win98 yet.
Other essential business start-up costs kindof come first.
Besides, win98 on a pentium 90 that's prone to crashing?? eeek I hate to think it

the problem was not that windows would reboot in mid defrag, but that scandisk would hang and lock up the whole puter so that we HAD to reboot to get ANYTHING to work!!!!

afterwards, we ran defrag, and it worked fine (the restarting thing was in defrag, yes, and it just went back to 8%, then picked up where it left off shortly there after) so that didn't worry us

but as we said, we got this puter second hand from a guy who'd built it himself, so we don't know what its got inside in terms of harddrive, motherboard, etc.

thinking re-formating might help clear off all the junk that's on there and start from scratch. drastic, yes, but.....

anyway, thanks for the thoughts

<edit>
umm.... does this FAT32 thing come on the disk with 95 OSR2? (what's the diff from plain 95?) how do I know which version I have?
(I have a newer version of 95 that came with my new pc. Think the one on the problem puter is 95 v4.00.950a versus mine which is B.)
</edit>

[This message has been edited by Shaytar (edited 02-14-99).]

[Justin]

Besides, win98 on a pentium 90 that's prone to crashing??
hehe - I have one friend running 98 on a 486 DX-66 and another running it on a 486 SX-20 laptop! Slow as could be, but it runs. I'm considering it for my SX-33 laptop, but the hard drive is only 170 MB.

I see you edited as I was clicking reply - 95b is a.k.a. OSR2 - I think. It's the last 95 release. I'm pretty sure FAT32 is there. You'll know when you fdisk. If it asks first thing if you want to enable large disk support, typing yes will set that up.

I forgot to mention that part. Formatting alone will not convert it. I highly recomend not using Window's conversion utility, which I don't think came with 95 at all. But you can use fdisk and tell it to enable large disk support, and then delete the primary partition. Then set up a new partition, using the full disk, and then it will be FAT32. Then you must format.

I'm not sure if this is exactly the same in 95, because it was like an add on for OSR2, and it might not be the same as it is in 98 - might want to check the book or the help system, see if there's anything about it. Also might want to try to find a readme on the CD (version b).

With that I must say that these are only recomendations, your milage may vary, use at your own risk, etc. - I'm not responsible. Just ask anyone I know http://www.aota.net/ubb/smile.gif


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Justin Nelson, SFE Inc.
http://www.vdj.net

[meikel]

Hi,

just some tips to follow before formatting:

a) Go into Control-Panel -> System and write down any hardware you have. If you don't know what's inside, you might have troubles finding the correct driver to get your PC up and running.

b) Try to get the most important drivers (graphics card, etc.) on a floppy before formatting.

c) Have a DOS Bootdisk ready which can access the CD-ROM (or you will have a problem).

Greetings from Bonn, Germany
[nbsp][nbsp]Meikel Weber
http://www.meikel.com

[Dean B]

As Meikel says, you will need a boot disk with your CDROM driver and MSCDEX on our you'll be stumped. Unless of course you have Win95 on floppies.

Dean.

[Jacob Stetser]

Oy.

I hope all this advice clears everything up for you, Shaytar and Bekariso.

This whole reformatting thing doesn't seem like much fun.

http://www.aota.net/ubb/frown.gif

Jake