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MTDesigns
09-26-1999, 08:56 AM
Since I do value all of your opinions, I figured what the heck ;) ...

I have a test page for a redesign here:
http://www.myparentime.com/indextest2.html

All comments appreciated!

There are some things that aren't quite right though, and I'm hoping someone will be able to give their advice :).

1. I understand what was said about creating a transparent spacer gif...but could someone give me a hint as to how to accomplish this in HTML?[nbsp][nbsp]Do I just add 1 column to the left and add the spacer as the only item in that column?

2. No matter what I do...removing & reducing size of images, the load time on my main page is still a bit long.[nbsp][nbsp]I would hate to take out anything else at this point, but I just might have to :(.

3. The "Go shopping" drop down box at the end of the 3rd column always adds a lot of space just above it (I don't add it)...I'd like to get rid of that space![nbsp][nbsp]Can someone tell me how??

4. The background behind the subhead "Share your Thoughts" doesn't quite go the length of the column as "Great Informative Site" does...wondering why?

Thanx for any comments you might have!

Joi~

Tatu
09-26-1999, 02:24 PM
The main thing that I like to be picky about:
Fitting the whole page into 600 pixels attractively for those who have smaller monitors (most people do, but in a few years we will be at an age where we don't need to worry about this :) ). When I minimize my browser screen to arround 600 pixels, the "My Parent Time is Your Parent Time" image cuts into the jagged border/background as does the 1st column in your table, and the 3rd column makes me have to scroll over to view it as a whole.

As for your number 3, I am dying to the the answer myself! I recentlyran into a few snags with stuff like that because of the differrent spaces caused in IE and NS.

-Tatu[nbsp]

LeafWind
09-26-1999, 04:47 PM
Joi:


1. I understand what was said about creating a transparent spacer gif...but could someone give me a hint as to how to accomplish this in HTML?[nbsp][nbsp]Do I just add 1 column to the left and add the spacer as the only item in that column?


Say, for a 100 pixel column on the left:

<body hspace=0 vspace=0 other_attributes=whatever>
<table attributes=whatever>
<tr>
<td width=100>
<img src=&quot;/path_to/spacer.gif&quot; height=1 width=150>
</td>
<td>
content here . . .

etc


(The hspace=0 vspace=0 in you body tag prevents browsers from &quot;padding&quot; images with extra space around them. The td width is optional, it *should* work if you leave it out, but I tend to put it in anyway.)


2. No matter what I do...removing &amp; reducing size of images, the load time on my main page is still a bit long.[nbsp][nbsp]I would hate to take out anything else at this point, but I just[nbsp][nbsp]might have to.


Part of the problem here might be the &quot;perception&quot; of long loading time, because everything is in tables, maybe even all in the same big outer table. (I didn't comb through your code to match up table tags so I don't know if you've done this, and on my cable modem, it all loads quite fast ;)[nbsp][nbsp]). . . In that case, none of the table contents would show until ALL of the table contents are received by the visitor's browser.[nbsp][nbsp]

Solution: split the big outer table into several tables whereever you can, so that content will be appearing in stages to give the visitor something to look at while the rest of it loads.

Eg, working with your current design without changing the look of it: put the banner ad outside any tables, it will show up right away. Put your logo and title banner and welcome text in a separate table. Then close that table and start a new one for your 3-column &quot;content&quot; section. Then close that table before your textlinks and buttons on the bottom (these might not need to be in a table at all).[nbsp][nbsp](Note that you'll want to put the spacer column in each separate table.)

so (pseudo code):

<html><body>

<img src=&quot;banner&quot;>

<table>
spacer
logo
title banner, and welcome text
</table>

<table>
spacer
content column 1
content column 2
content column 3
</table>

text-links and buttons

</body>
</html>



3. The &quot;Go shopping&quot; drop down box at the end of the 3rd column always adds a lot of space just above it (I don't add it)...I'd like to get rid of that space![nbsp][nbsp]Can someone tell me how??


um . . . sorry, don't know offhand . . . :o I use FQ's built in redirection script for drop-down menus, and I don't think I've had this problem. . . . I don't see anything obvious in your HTML at first glance, but I don't know JavaScript which you seem to have going on there.


4. The background behind the subhead &quot;Share your Thoughts&quot; doesn't quite go the length of the column as &quot;Great Informative Site&quot; does...wondering why?


Because you coded it that way . . . look:

<TABLE border=&quot;0&quot; BGCOLOR=&quot;#FFFFFF&quot;>
<TR align=&quot;center&quot; bgcolor=&quot;#ffee2b&quot;>
<TD align=&quot;center&quot;>
<FONT color=&quot;#ff00bd&quot; size=&quot;4&quot;>Great Informative Site!</FONT></FONT></TD>


compare to:


<TABLE border=&quot;0&quot; align=&quot;center&quot; BGCOLOR=&quot;#FFFFFF&quot; <font color=#FF0000>width=&quot;240&quot;</font>>
<TR align=&quot;center&quot; bgcolor=&quot;#ffee2b&quot;>
<TD align=&quot;center&quot; <font color=#FF0000>width=&quot;240&quot;</font>>
<CENTER><FONT color=&quot;#ff00bd&quot; size=&quot;4&quot;>Share Your Thoughts!</FONT></FONT></TD>


Other than that, comments . . . looks good, except when resized . . . it doesn't work at 600 pixel's wide.[nbsp][nbsp]

To get it to work at resolutions from 600 pixels wide on up, here's what I would do:
For each table:
1) Figure out the minimum width you want for each column, so that the total of the columns, plus their cellspacing and padding (if you have them set), add up to 585 pixels.[nbsp][nbsp]
2) Put a spacer.gif in each column (at the bottom below your text works fine) sized to the minimum width you want each column to be.[nbsp][nbsp]
3) Set your table width to 100% and don't set pixel widths in your <td> tags except for the left spacer column (though you can use width percentages).

Result: when the browser window is larger than 600, the table will &quot;expand&quot; to fill the available width, when the browser window is 600, the table will &quot;shrink&quot; to the widths of the spacers (the spacer.gif's prevent the column width from getting any smaller than that width).

Hope this helps . . .

Bekariso
------------------
www.LeafWind.com (http://www.LeafWind.com)
Growing web sites that thrive in the winds of change.

MTDesigns
09-26-1999, 07:12 PM
WoW! Thanx so much for all your comments![nbsp][nbsp]I'm going to print them out and see if I can put them to work ;) .

Thanx again!!!

Joi~

Tatu
09-26-1999, 08:23 PM
Sorry for the foum hi-jacking! :)
BTW, I get the same space thing with the AOTA redirection ones too and I have noticed it is a differrent spacing in IE and NS. And if anyone knows how to change the size of a Jscript form (like the redirection thingy) in EI they need to post! As far as I see, the size only changes in NS and I have almost tried everything.

MTDesigns
09-26-1999, 08:26 PM
OK, I must be doing something wrong...I switched the shopping drop down box to FQ's redirection code and it still adds all that space above it! ARGGH!!

Also, I originally had the tables separated as you suggested...but I have a question about the column widths.[nbsp][nbsp]It seems that no matter what width I specify for the center column, the 2 last subheads (share your thoughts &amp; visit our stores) just don't show up as the top subheads do (ie: great informative site). :(

When I do the spacer, do I understand that it does have to be transparent?[nbsp][nbsp]Also, what size should I make it...the width of the left background border?

I'm sorry for all these questions....just a little buggy from working too much on this :D!

Thanx again!

Joi~

sheila
09-26-1999, 11:50 PM
I have to say, I like your current design much better than the previous ones. Those dark purple background columns never did anything for me.

Can't say I like your sense of color combos much, but that's my personal thing, I guess. This is the best color combo on your site I've seen so far.