Has NS halted development?

[Mandi]

So, have they?[nbsp][nbsp]Seems like we haven't seen ANYthing new out of them since they were bought by AOL . . . especially in light of the MSIE 5 release.[nbsp][nbsp]Anyone got their ear closer to the ground than me on this subject?

[Justin]

I don't remember where I read this at (probably C|Net) but I think they are considering NS a lost cause...

When they went open source over a year ago with the Mozilla project, they were hoping to have thousands of programmers helping with the developement of Netscape, but now a year later, only 30 people have contributed - and there are more people than that on the actual developement team...

From what I understand, this has nothing to do with the AOL buyout. It was looking bad before that event (makes me wonder if that's part of why they sold..?)

MS had a few hundred people or more working on IE5, and from what I understand there's about 5000 programmers working on Windows 2000 (I wonder if the code resembles Ted's code? I'm sure it's a nightmare LOL :) )

I was also pretty sure that they were still pushing to release NS 5 though - but I haven't heard anything for a while...

Justin

[Charles Capps]

Netscape 4.6 was just released the other day with a few bugfixes...[nbsp][nbsp]From what I've heard, Mozilla 5 is still on schedule for a July/August (summer) beta release.
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"Okay, so I'm not "SANE" so to speak, but uh... I'm the lovable kind of psycho"
http://solareclipse.net/

[LeafWind]

Netscape a lost cause?[nbsp][nbsp]Well that would be depressing.[nbsp][nbsp]After trying on IE5, I'm more committed to Netscape than ever.[nbsp][nbsp]After an hour's struggle with it to do the Rite of the Icon thing and test it, I can't stand Exploder5![nbsp][nbsp]Maybe if I took a few more hours to see if I can configure it, but right now, it's not worth it.

Hmm, thanks for keeping us posted.

Bekariso

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www.LeafWind.com (http://www.LeafWind.com)
Growing web sites that thrive in the winds of change.

[Armand]

Try here http://headlines.yahoo.com/Full_Coverage/Tech/AOL___Netscape_Merger/

edit:***urrgh wouldn't link thanks to Justin's mods here****
[This message has been edited by Armand (edited 05-19-99)]

[Bi4Be]

I too waswondering whats up with the non upgrades! I sure hope NS doesn't ever give up to microsoft, letting the ;bad guys' win after such a long hard struggle. :(

And if it will be a lost cause, I will be one of the proud few to still be using NS 4.04 10 years from now. :D

[Justin]

What do you mean it wouldn't link???

[Armand]

Yeah Justin it didn't link the first time when I used the ubb url code, which was typographically correct as far as ubb code goes.[nbsp][nbsp]Go figure.. had to go in and take the ubb code out and added the http:// to make it recognize.[nbsp][nbsp]No biggie... just threw me off.
[This message has been edited by Armand (edited 05-20-99)]

[Justin]

You have to start it with either http:// or www before it will link, even in url tags. The UBB normally would allow it I think, but I changed a few things - one reason being that the stock UBB won't link an ftp:// link properly - it adds http:// to anything that doesn't have it already, even if it has an ftp:// - besides, it is customary to use http:// for a URL that doesn't start with www (at least that's how I set up this version to work).

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Justin Nelson
FutureQuest Support

[jenili]

No upgrades? Communicator 4.6 is available for download today.
http://download.netscape.com/


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jeni

[Monica]

I'm with you Bi4Be![nbsp][nbsp]

I've upgraded numerous times with my NS.[nbsp][nbsp]I did 4.6 a few days ago... and chucked it, and went back to 4.0.[nbsp][nbsp]Too many quirky little things that bugged me.[nbsp][nbsp]With each upgrade I've done, I keep going back to 4.0!

Tens years from now... at least I know I'll have a least one person I'll be able to communicate with, LOL!

[ChrisH]

They've been doing little upgrades, but 5.0 will
be a complete rewrite from the ground up. The ideas
are very cool . . . we'll have to see what really
comes out, though. Take a look at www.mozilla.org (http://www.mozilla.org)
and maybe you can get some of the ideas, though
it's basically a programmer's site.


[nbsp][nbsp]ch

[flowersource]

I'm writing this as someone who grew up with Netscape when MS Internet Explorer was really a piece of junk. (ver 1.0?)

I never would have thought that I would use any browser other than Netscape.

Now considering that today, most experienced Netscape users and experienced Explorer users generally do not like the other product (except to check browser compatibility when viewing html code), I would have to guess that both products work well. Although, if you check browser stats (internet wide, not just your own) you will see that the use of Netscape is steadily declining.

My personal preference (today) is Explorer 5.0 I cannot get Netscape to function properly, at least to my expectations, based upon using IE 5.0.

It loads pages slooow, it seems to lock up a lot, yada yada... But on the other hand there are Netscape users who are extremely happy with Netscape.

I would have to guess that the polarization is mostly caused by experiences such as mine...we simply have not used the 'other' product enough to get familiar and comfortable with it's features and limitations. Just like with any software, it takes getting used to. Some of my problems with Netscape are undoubtIedly caused by my ignorance.I'm sure that Netscape is a usable browser (33% of you are using it). I surely hope that Netscape doesn't go away, maybe someday I'll find a version of it that I like better than IE.

I had to re-install two 'clean' hard drives in my computer yesterday (14 gig total), guess which browser I did not install? :D

It's not like I don't have room for it. It just doesn't work as well for me as the 'other' browser.
end of[nbsp][nbsp]my $0.02

Mike

[Bi4Be]

Actually, to be exact (according to AOTA's stats ;) ):
58% MS Browsers Visit Here
40% NS Browsers Visit Here
[nbsp]2% 'Other' Browsers Visit Here

On the top list of browsers, Mozilla/4.* is #1 so far.

Interesting Tidbit: "Nutscrape 1.*" is # 16! It litterally says the "u" instead of the "e". And how would it get to #16 anyways?!? Does a regular forum member use it or something?

-Bi4Be, a nerd for the facts :D

[Charles Capps]

Access stats for solareclipse.net...
42(v4) + 8(v3) = 50% Netscape
17(v5) + 29(v4) + 4(v3) = 50% Internet Explorer

I've rounded up, of course... 1.5% or so goes to other browsers, such as Lotus Notes (!!!), Lynx, and "VCI WebViewer VCI WebViewer Win32"

------------------
"Okay, so I'm not "SANE" so to speak, but uh... I'm the lovable kind of psycho"
http://solareclipse.net/

[Armand]

Rounded off also but 55% IE, 45% NS... more proof that things are still fairly even out there on the web.

[DanS]

flowersource:[nbsp][nbsp]I suppose the reason that people go with what they are used to is that Netscape and IE render the pages slightly differently, and use slightly different color substitutions, etc.[nbsp][nbsp]Since I am a Netscape user, it only stands to reason that I am familiar with and partial to Netscape.[nbsp][nbsp]As much as I have tried, whenever I load a page in IE, I think to myself "that looks awful."[nbsp][nbsp]But it's probably just familiarity, as you state.

Now if IE 5 is that much more stable and quick-loading, I might have to make a change. ;)

I think the real reason NS seems to have fallen off lately, is that they are no longer looking at a six-month version development cycle.[nbsp][nbsp]Looks more like a year now.[nbsp][nbsp]Which still is a brisk pace.[nbsp][nbsp]I'm hoping that NS 5 is a leap forward, but I'm not holding my breath.

[Justin]

Ok, I just have to try it now - I'm going to download IE5. As a dedicated IE4 user, I think I'm just used to IE really - I know people who've been on the net longer and they are usually NS dedicated - but to be honest I've been on the net less than a year and have always used IE4...

But if IE5 is that much faster - well, I have to see this myself :)[nbsp][nbsp]Off to M$ :þ

Justin

[DanS]

Justin:[nbsp][nbsp]I used Mosaic.[nbsp][nbsp]Netscape was a dream after that. ;)

[flowersource]

The percentage that I posted (33%) of Netscape users and...declining, is from the GLOBAL stats (a sample of 25 million hits) at http://thecounter.com

I keep an eye on the GLOBAL stats 'cause I sometimes use html tags that are not recognized by older Netscape browsers. Just like to know how many people cannot see some elements on the page as I intended.

IE isn't perfect, I don't sell it, it just works better for me. (or at least I think it does)

Mike
[This message has been edited by flowersource (edited 05-22-99)]

[pier]

I used Mosaic.[nbsp][nbsp]Netscape was a dream after that

I still remember those days back in '93 when I had 1 (one) disk, on which were my Internet-Browser, news-reader, gopher-client and NuPOP (mail-client), and there was even room left for saving my mail...

Pier
-- Ie5-installation: downloading 36Mb...

[Jacob Stetser]

There's a reason Netscape is unstable under Windows. It's called Microsoft.

Anyhow, I remember the days of all my Internet software fitting on a floppy too. It was cool. :)

I wonder how the MS antitrust trial is coming along. I hope they get socked for what they did to Netscape! :)

Jake -- running on 17.2 gigs now :)

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icongarden.com/?fq (http://icongarden.com/?fq)
icongarden: making good ideas grow.

[Armand]

I've stuck with Netscape personally because IE seems to take twice as long to load pages on.[nbsp][nbsp]I tried to download IE 5.0 since it's supposedly faster... but MS new download setup is an ABSOLUTELY NIGHTMARE for me since I don't have a regular ip.[nbsp][nbsp]Had to give up hope on upgrading until can change ISP.

[Justin]

Well, I downloaded it, and it really does render pages much faster :)[nbsp][nbsp]I didn't think I'd notice a difference, but wow - it's pretty darned cool if you ask me :)

Justin[nbsp]

[Justin]

I just clicked the download link and went to sleep. When I woke up it was asking me to reboot - then it imported a few thousand emails and was done.

OE5 is awesome BTW - I have never like Eudora, Calypso, The Bat, Pegasis, or any other email client (and I've tried them all except for Netscape... I only have Navigator). I always liked Outlook, and OE5 seems to have fixed some of the bugs that plagued version 4 (deciding to hang for 30 seconds at a time, etc). It also supports seperate signatures for seperate accounts as well as automatically sending a message using the account it was received from (a HUGE plus for me hehe - I've send a support mail or two from vdj.net lol).

All in all, I thought this upgrade wouldn't be that great, which is why I waited so long, but I'm definately impressed :D[nbsp][nbsp]Always been a dedicated IE user - but of course when Netscape 5 comes around I have to download it just to see... I'm a download nut :)

<edit>
One last thing - my favorite part is the &quot;Go&quot; button. I sometimes cruise around without the keyboard (laying it on the floor or the desk) and before, if I paste a URL in the address bar, I'd have to reach over and press &quot;Enter&quot; - not any more :)
</edit>

Justin
[This message has been edited by Justin (edited 05-22-99)]

[DanS]

Have you guys tried Neoplanet's dual browser capability?[nbsp][nbsp]Really, it runs off of IE's core, but can render in IE or NS and switches at the push of a button (so to speak).[nbsp][nbsp]Download the beta at www.neoplanet.com (http://www.neoplanet.com).[nbsp][nbsp]Download cost =~ 4.5 MB.[nbsp][nbsp]It looks to me like it doesn't render fonts quite the same at Netscape (i.e., it must still use some IE rendering, which I hate).[nbsp][nbsp]I'm not sure about color substitutions.[nbsp][nbsp]It's not that stable yet.

I just like the cool Neoplanet skins.[nbsp][nbsp]To have it render NS is a bonus.

[Charles Capps]

I played around a bit last night with the Mozilla 5...[nbsp][nbsp]Quite interesting.[nbsp][nbsp]It rendered things quite a bit like IE5...[nbsp][nbsp]:)
------------------
"Okay, so I'm not "SANE" so to speak, but uh... I'm the lovable kind of psycho"
http://solareclipse.net/

[Justin]

I haven't tried Neoplanet yet, and probably never will. Anyone can make an IE web browser - anyone with a copy of Visual Basic 5 or 6, or MS VC++ has the IE ActiveX control built in. I made a browser in 5 minutes one day - was no different than IE4 except it had a button to turn off popup windows. And yes, literally 5 minutes - drop the control on a form, set a few properties to turn on the toolbar, status bar, etc (so it's all provided for you), and add a button that cancels popups before they pop up.

Neoplanet is just a wrapper for IE - not sure how they do the NS thing but I'm willing to bet it's some search and replace in the HTML that's rendered to make it look like Netscape... or even just a global style sheet (something anyone can make and set in IE as default, and it probably just turns off link hover colors, etc).

Not that I'm knocking the idea, but Neoplanet is not a browser - it's a program (probably Visual Basic) that has a face on top of IE - this is why when you upgrade from IE4 to IE5, Neoplanet is magically upgraded too (the browser engine anyhow).

I just wish they would put a button to kill the popups anyway... I've never seen a popup that I've found useful - mostly Geocities ads. If MS would add that little button, poor Geocities and Tripod, etc would have to redesign their entire systems :)

-------------
Justin
- Loving IE5's much improved back button

[Charles Capps]

Justin: The new NeoPlanet browser is both a wrapper and a full integration of the Mozilla source.[nbsp][nbsp]:)
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"Okay, so I'm not "SANE" so to speak, but uh... I'm the lovable kind of psycho"
http://solareclipse.net/

[DanS]

Armand:[nbsp][nbsp]tell me about it.[nbsp][nbsp]I've had so many problems getting it installed that I keep thinking that they're doing everything in their power to keep me from using it.[nbsp][nbsp]Conspiracy? ;)

[DanS]

Yes, it must have been much tougher to integrate into NS, because it took them a long time to do it.

Functionality aside, I think Neoplanet's skins add to the websurfing experience.[nbsp][nbsp]Nothing wrong with looking pretty![nbsp][nbsp]UBB, for instance.

[Justin]

I didn't realize that Neoplanet is in fact a browser (using NS source - so it's C++) - like I said, never downloaded it...

You got me on the UBB thing though :)[nbsp][nbsp]There are other boards that offer more functionality (and most are free) but the UBB has a nicer interface despite the poor coding and even worse HTML...

I might download it one day just to see what it's all about - but as for a web browser, I prefer it to be as out of the way as possible and don't care what the browser looks like - just so it renders the HTML right :D[nbsp][nbsp]But it does sound interesting nonetheless...

Justin